Editor’s Note: Here’s an interesting thread from the PSW Live Audio Board (LAB) forums. It’s lightly edited for grammar and formatting. Enjoy.
Posted by Ivan
I have been out of the direct rental business for 16 yrs now, so I don’t often see riders anymore-but somebody passed this on to me and I was wondering how often you see this-and how is it “checked”.
I totally understand the whole “rider game,” but just wondering if anybody has actually insisted on something like the following.
“The freq response of the system shall be equal to or greater than 20Hz to 20KHz and must provide an SPL of 120dB (no weighting specified) over 95% of the audience.
I am not away of systems that can actually get all the way to 20Khz and down to 20Hz-especially at the rear areas of the audience at 120dB “continuous”. This was for a “bass heavy” live act. I guess I am just wanting to “update” my knowledge on what people are requesting these days.
This is for a festival situation, and some other interesting things on a couple of the riders were “NO DIGITAL CONSOLES”, “NO ANALOG CONSOLES” (both of those were all caps and bold-different riders of course).
Another interesting thing was with the “no analog consoles,” there were lots of outboard gear-mic pres-compressors-effects etc. that would be used with analog consoles.
And one band had a “NO XYZ SPEAKERS.” The XYZ speakers in this case would be the most recognized brand and most rider friendly speakers out there. I just found it “interesting.”
Any thoughts would be appreciated (specifically on the freq response). I know it is a “wish list,” but how often do people actually meet it.
OF COURSE they did not say how far down in level the 20Hz or 20KHz could be- so that may be the “way out.” SURE it produces it, and it is only 30dB down——————-
Reply by Brian
Unless you’re dealing with a-list bands, the rider is a general guideline, at best.
At a festival situation, there is only so much that you can do. It’s usually best to have a discussion before they arrive as to what on the rider is not realistic. Many times, they won’t have a clue as to what the technical things in the rider means anyway. I highly doubt that there has been ANY system at a regional festival that could produce 20-20K @ 120db over 95% of the audience. That would take one heck of a system, unless the audience was a crowd of 12.
Reply by Jamin
That’s when you say, “Sure, we can do that. Here’s what it will cost for what the rider requires.” $$$$$$$$$$$
“Here’s what it will cost for something adequate.” $$$$ “Let me know which one you choose.”
Reply by Steve
You missed one! “Here’s what it will cost for something inadequate.” $
Reply by Tim
I recently got one for an old country act that required one stack a side of any pa (not specified), that could do 150 DB at front of house!
Reply by Ivan
Maybe it was really tall.
Reply by Jamin
An old country act that needs 150dB? Crazy. Just locate FOH 1ft in front of the mains…and turn it up really loud
Reply by Stephan
20kHz @120dB keeps all the dogs for miles around out of the venue. The old 20-20 was a hi-fi axiom from back in the day when no transducer could achieve it. Amazing that people in production would still dredge it up.
Reply by Bob
I can hear a dog whistle at 100 yards. Ever hear a dog whistle? They usually only know one song.
Reply by Tim
They’re deaf. Or will be soon.
Reply by Steve
20Hz to 20kHz… +/- how many dB? And how many of us can hear much over 16kHz?
Reply by John
I can’t hear a test tone over 11k. Checked it with a 30 year old dancer and she topped out at 14k.
Reply by Steve
Mine drops off at 14kHz and is almost non existent at 16kHz.
Reply by John
Are you a 30 yr old dancer?
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